Again, sukh, du:kh, paap and punya.

[mk]

Namonamah,
If in the process of enjoying sukh, we consume the punya that got us the sukh in the first place, is it so about du:kh too? i.e. by undergoing du:kh, do we get rid of ("consume") the paap that resulted in our undergoing the du:kh in the first place?
Taking it further, by deliberately placing oneself in a position of du:kh can one rid himself/herself of some paap? Is that the reason/misconception why some (no, not JV) people undertake penance, pilgrimage etc.?

Thanks and Best Wishes
Milind Khadilkar

[MEENA PATKAR]

to,
mk,

vithalvithal
what I think is,
by deliberately placing oneself in a position of Du:kh one  can not get rid of his paap.on the contrary it will creat more paap.
Undertaking penance  or pilgrimage creats action of bothering the humanbody---that will have the reaction of damage to his own body i e . it will give du:kh in physical terms.It will not rub out the subtle impressions of bad actions done by oneself to others.For understanding better pl. refer to Shri Sadguru's Book "Paap-Punya"

to rub out this paap ,satkarmas should be done consistantly on three levels thought,speeach & deed.

Thanking you ,
meena

May God bless all

[sukhsiddhi]

Namaskar Meenatai  ,
                                     I totally agree with you mam...! by doing penance you give pain to yourself and yourself is god only then how can u please god by troubling yourself???

 God bless you all...!

             

[mk]

Namonamah
Sikhsiddhijee, Namaste,



"... troubling yourself...."?
Troubling yourself involves troubling your mind and troubling your body. JV is very clear about the first with its tenet "Shareer saakshaat/ parameshwar": we should take proper care of our bodies. For nourishment of our minds, VP is mandated. Does JV indicate what could torture a mind nourished by VP?

"... please god..."?

Isn't that non JV, as I have been led to believe?

Thanks and best wishes,

Milind Khadilkar

[sukhsiddhi]

Namaskaar mkjee  ,
                                I'm sorry sir I'm not able to understand what you are trying to say...! and yes sir you can call me siddhi also....! God bless you...!

[mk]

Namonamah,
Siddhijee, sorry for mis-spelling your name in the last post.

Please don't 'sir' me. I am not even a "proper" student here on this forum. About not understanding what I was trying to say, you need not feel sorry. I am the problem there. I write only with the thought of "what to write" in my mind, and often ignore the fact that it has also to be understood by others. It is I who should say sorry.

I was refering to your earlier post. I started wondering what could be the meaning of torturing oneself. I could easily visualize what bodily toture could be. But I am not sure what could torture a mind which has been continuously nourished by VP. What form could this torture take? What could be the effects of such torture? Please note that I am speaking exclusively about minds under the "protection" of VP. Also note that Meenajee in her post had referred to "damage to...body" only.

The second point was about your use of the phrase "then how can u please god ". I am not sure, but I feel JV wants people to get away from the concept of pleasing God. I was wondering if you were using the term in some different sense.

I hope I have made myself clearer.

Thanks and best wishes

Milind Khadilkar

[sukhsiddhi]

Vitthal Vitthal Mkjee  ,
                                   What could torture a mind filled with VP? This is your question. The person whose mind is filled with VP behaves in harmony with the laws of nature, because he/she is totally aware about the effects of not biding the laws of nature. So whenever he/she comes across a person, who is behaving contrary to the laws of nature feels sad and is torturous to the person who chants VP. Sometimes unknowingly VP sadhak may hurt somebody that is also torturous for the sadhak. May god bless you all...............!

[mk]

Namonamah,
Thank you Siddhijee,
Is such torture as you mention bad, or is it good (in the context of the original question)? Does feeling bad about something and thereby torturing oneself result in accumulation of paap or of punnya?

Thanks and Best wishes
Milind Khadilkar

[sukhsiddhi]

Vitthal Vitthal mkjee  ,
                                    When  the VP sadhak feels sad about the persons who are not behaving in harmony with the laws of nature, he/she prays for the particular person/s that they should be blessed with good intelligence (sadbuddhi de)  to the god. So this action will not create paap but rather punya only....!

May god bless all ..............!

[mk]

Namonamah,
Siddhijee, you are probably right. But then what gives punnya hardly qualifies to be called torture. And if it does, then it means self torture need not be always bad, and so penance, pilgrimage etc. could also lead to punnya (which is probably why JV does not denounce it so strongly, just proposes "better" alternatives).

Is there anything else that could torture a mind nurtured by VP?

Thanks and best wishes

Milind Khadilkar

[subhash]

MK,

I would rather not think of even an iota of suffering. My option is consume good impressions and enjoy life but at the same time create new good impressions. Self-inflicted punishment seems unnecessary and avoidable.

I would do the following:

1. Love work and bless all
2. Wish blissfully
3. Try to do all work in meditation

Thus I will consume good impressions, earn good impressions and change the stack in my favour over a long term benefit. I will also change my habitual thinking to good thinking through this.

When I have a better option available, I will not go for other options, by design.

God bless you, God bless all,
Subhash